May 08 2008
2008 – The Year Of The Centrists
As a conservative independent I of course like to view the world through my only lens of preferences, but I think it is safe to say I have my biases fairly well checked when I claim this year Americans are heading away from the hyper-partisan fringes, weary of nearly 3 decades of hyper-partisan rancor and dysfunctional zer-sum games. We see it playing out in the Democrat and Republican sides.
On the left we see the stronger general election candidate, Hillary Clinton, losing to the more liberal Obama. Clinton is much stronger against McCain, but she keeps losing ground to Obama the more her general election electability shows. The Democrat Party is being taken over by the far left which is itching to come out of the closet. That is why when Wright and Ayers come up it doesn’t hurt Obama in the primaries, just kills him for the general
It is also playing out on the right as the ‘true conservative” far right bemoans McCain’s positions and their 20-25% keep voting against him in GOP primaries. The problem is the GOP is tired of the self destructiveness of the far right who call people who disagree with the Quislings and Traitors (just ask anyone who support Comprehensive Immigration Reform why there will be no alliances with the hyper-right any more).
The most enjoyable example of this was on Sean Hannity’s radio show when he hosted “The Architect” Karl Rove. Hannity made the mistake of trying to paint McCain’s problems with the ‘true conservatives’ as a liability. His two examples were “The Gang of 14” and Comprehensive Immigration Reform (which I am glad to see McCain is bring back as part of his policy plans when elected), which McCain notes openly with well deserved pride. Hannity was not prepared to be ripped a new one by Rove who just destroyed Hannity’s far right biases against McCain.
On the Gang of 14 Rove noted that the compromise gave Democrats cover to allow numerous conservative federal judges to be seated as well as Roberts and Alito on the US SC. Rove noted that he had his doubts initially, but came to recognize the Gang of 14 was critical to the administration’s efforts to mold the judiciary in line with conservative, constructionist principles.
On immigration reform Rove really nailed Hannity and the “Amnesty Hypochondriacs”. Of course the word “Amnesty” was selected by the opponents of immigration reform because it was the root of their resistance – they did not want the 1 in 5 workers (Rove’s number) here illegally to get off with a fine, paying back taxes and proving they are free of violent crimes. This obsession with desiring much stronger actions than the law or America were prepared to invoke is why I call the “Amnesty Hypochondriacs”.
Besides pointing out to Hannity that 1 in 5 workers here are illegal and we cannot simply have them leave without killing our economy, he noted that Bush ended the 30 year long practice of catch-and-release, where illegals found on the border were given a date to be in court and then released, wherein they never showed up. Rove noted the last catch-and-release was in 2006, after Bush led the way in providing all sorts of resources for personnel and facilities required to end the practice.
Another point Rove hammered home is most people do not know that 1.3 million illegal aliens attempting to cross our borders were sent back home last year – a very, very impressive number which shows our borders ARE being strengthened. Nothing will be foolproof, but that is amazing progress the Amnesty Hypochondriacs dismiss out of fear that the day will come when we do deal with the long term illegals with less than deportation or coerced deportation. Oh well, those far right dreams will never happen.
Which brings me back to why McCain is doing so well right now. Every time Hannity or Ingraham or Malkin go ballistic because McCain is not conservative enough the provide McCain distance from the one association that would give him trouble in the general election. Obama has problems because of his new found ties to the radical left. McCain is gaining credibility with the continued flames from the far right (who are not radical like the left, just way out of the mainstream like the left).
I have seen attempts by the far left to tie McCain to folks on the far right – and it fails because everyone knows the far right is ready to sit out this election, especially if McCain keeps his pledge to implement comprehensive immigration reform. So while Obama can be attacked by his far left political associations (which avoids the backlash of attacking Obama directly), McCain cannot be tied to a group that cannot stop spouting off their dislike of the man.
And this is why I am fairly certain this year America is staying away from the hyper-partisans. All indications are McCain is perfectly set up to take advantage of this, and the far right is doing their part to help him. And all indications are Hillary is losing because of this, and Obama and his far left buddies are doing their part in hurting him more in the general election. Sweet.
BTW – just a reminder McCain was one of my last choices from the beginning and I posted on his weak support for the sanctity of life through his support of Embryonic Stem Cell Research, an issue I care very deeply about. So am by no means a McCainiac, but like most independence more pragmatic than driven to the political extremes on either side.
I think that Republicans can be both moderate and conservative, with most leaning conservative. I think they would prefer a center right president, leaning right. But I also think that most Republicans want to win, especially now and they recognize that McCain is their best bet to do that right now.
And no I do not think that a lot of Democrats were voting in the Republican primary because they had their own primary to vote in and it was much too hot a race for them to ignore. After all, they won’t let you vote in both. And look at the numbers of people who turned out to vote in those Democratic primaries. They were not sitting them out so that they could vote for McCain and piss off some Republicans.
McCain was most feared by most Dems. The Dems can’t compete with his biography.
I don’t buy the sub labels of conservatives. We just prioritize the issues differently. So, I consider McCain a conservative, same as Bush and Reagan . I disagree with him on campaign finance “reform”, but agree on enough other issues.
It would be national suicide to elect “Marxist”, demagogue O’Bama or corrupt Clinton.
Terrye,
McCain is the only bet left to do that right now…and they will vote for him. Let’s all pray that he’s enough.
If you don’t think dems weren’t voting for McCain to stir up the Republican Party than you are naive. I believe Daily Kos was the first to call the “rank and file” to action. And they follow him like lambs to the slaughter.
And I do not believe for one minute that McCain was who the left feared most especially because of his biography. The left believes that this country wants to end this war now at any cost. They believe that the country hates President Bush, and the troops and all that America stands for. McCain’s biography is an asset to them (so they think). But it is the one thing McCain has that will bond conservatives and right leaning moderates. The Dems have never been known to be very bright…but that’s because they think they are the only ones who are right. They are so right (in their minds) that just watch what they will do to McCain…with the aid of the MSM. It’s going to be a bloodbath. Let’s hope he can overcome it.
McCain is not a military genius who is going to be rolling out maps of Iraq and Afghanistan and personally moving troops like a chess match with brilliance. The difference between McCain and Obama on Iraq is rhetoric. Both understand the dangers of a rapid withdrawal and the objectives for success. They may have slightly different ideas about what success is but the reality is these are wars that can’t be officially won. From that point of view, rhetoric aside, their positions are very similar.
My current biggest concerns are taxes, energy independence, illegal immigration, and character and leadership. McCain has been quite irritating on the first three. Obama on taxes is outrageous! On alternative energy they are the same. Obama, personally shows more leadership ability and is a far better communicator, charismatic, etc. Both are calculating politicians, however.
Overall McCain is getting my vote. I don’t want the dems with a full power… Whether he will win… I put my bets on Obama. That is because I think you’re right the country is moving center-left giving Obama the advantage.
Terrye,
“You are kidding yourself if you think Democrats picked McCain, in fact in polls of Republicans McCain had more support than any other Republican running. And in national polls Romney could only get about 29% support among the general electorate.
But I see what the tact will be here. Conservatives will say the same thing Democrats said in 2000 when Bush won. They will say they were robbed.
Sore losers.”
Go back and look at it again Terrye…or have you forgotten how many candidates were attempting to get the Republican nomination?
After they were all gone and McCain had it sewed up it still took him quite a while to even gain over 49% of the votes in the next primaries. All this time later and there’s still little excitement for his candidacy…that won’t change much.
Conservatives will say they were robbed? That’s the funniest thing I’ve heard all day! You obviously don’t know many conservatives do you? Playing the victim card comes from your former party…not mine. Victims never take responsibility for their actions……..
And Hillary scares me as much as Obama….Andif you would take the hypothetical choice and vote for her then you would be abandoning the War on Terror, wouldn’t you? How’s it feel when the shoe is on the other foot?
Terrye,
“As for what party I left, what do you care? I thought we were all entitled to vote or not vote for who we wanted.”
Left by Terrye on May 9th, 2008
Now do you get it? You just made my point only you’re still too blind to see it.
McCain is going to get clobbered. Obama has a rally and thousands show up, old young, white black. McCain has a rally and there are about fifty old white people standing around. The dems are getting about twice as many people voting in the primaries than the pubs. The war on terror could hurt McCain as much as it can help him because the public wants it wrapped up soon and McCain hasn’t really shown he would do that. Obama is just like Bill Clinton, a lying SOB with a lot of charisma. That’s about all dems need to vote for someone. McCain on the other hand, is an ill-tempered OOOOLLLLLDDDD man. He is lousy on his feet in a debate. When him and Obama debate, McCain will spew what he has rehearsed and Obama will say nothing with eloquence. And all the retards in the press will talk about how smooth Obama was and the retards watching will believe it. McCain has already shown that he will continue to stick his finger in the eye of his conservative base. Things like having Juan Hernandez on his staff, meeting with La Raza,(read racist mexican bastards), having a hispanic language website, going for the global warming hoax, and a number of other little tidbits show that he does not think he needs the conservative base to win. HE IS WRONG! He cannot win without a strong showing of the conservatives and he is not even getting all of their votes when he is ALLREADY GOT THE NOMINATION! The last two primaries showed about a quarter of the people voting for someone else even though it won’t make any difference. Some of the polls have him losing to Obama and the contest between him and Obama hasn’t even started yet. The very groups he is dumping conservatives to court, hispanics and independants, are going to be leaning democrat like they always do. People are fed up with the Bush adminisration, they see an economy where gas has gone up a buck a gallon in seven months, and a housing situation that looks dim to say the least. Whether it is true or not, there is a common feeling among the lower income people that the Bush admin has botched it with the economy, and a lot of those people are dems and independants. They want a change, as stupid as that is if you don’t say what the change is going to be.
Wake up and smell the coffee. The dems succeeded with the help of the ‘independants’ and ‘moderates’ (dem lites) in foisting this candidate upon the GOP. He is going to get beat like an ugly stepchild.
Oh, and Terrye, you said you’re not voting for a dem this election? Lets see, you have two running with that party and another who has threatened to jump to that side twice. Either way, dems win in 2008,
B Ken,
You accurately describe O’bama and his fans. And McCain’s age is a factor, but so was Reagan’s.
I doubt all the mobs rallying to O’bama will vote. O’bama is vacuous and it will show in the debates. McCain knows a lot of stuff and it will also show.
As for his “ill temper” and unpredictability, both O’bama and the terrorists had better beware.
Bikerken,
But don’t you know it’s those independents and moderates who are going to save the Party? Which party I’m not sure, but neither I suspect. They’re the saviors of the world!!! Only the centrists have the answers! (sarc)
If the past is any indication of the future…they’ve already deserted one party and left it to fester and rot with the radicals of the left…and now they’ve moved on to the right…gee…I wonder what happens next?
It must be tough to compromise your principals away to sit on the fence in the middle hoping for a power play to come your way. They talk a big game, unless of course it comes to issues near and dear to their heart…can’t compromise there…just on “your” issues. They’ve got their “centrist” man now…they’re just afraid to own him. But they’re more than willing to set up the scenario already that if he loses they’re not to blame…it’s the conservatives fault.
The media will make Obama appear like the second coming and McCain look like a bumbling idiot.
And they’ll use McCain’s own words to do it.
People loved Reagan Mack. McCains Campaign slogan could be, I’m not as crappy a choice as the other guy. That’s not going to inspire conservatives to go to the polls. As for Obama’s fans not showing up, you could be right, but the fact is, if only half of them do, Juan is still in trouble. Sad fact: not all voters are that smart. McCain’s debate problem is that he doesn’t seem to think on his feet well. All he does is repeat what he’s been programed to say and it sounds like it. As for scaring terrorists, he plans on doing the one thing that could hamstring the war on terror like nothing else. He believes terrorists are eligible for Geneva convention rights. I heard him say that on O’Reilly tonight. O’Reilly challenged him saying that non-uniformed combatants did not fall under the Geneva convention. McCain’s response was to say that the Geneva Convention did specify the treatment of illegal combatants but he did not specify what that was. In the Geneva convention, non-uniformed combatants can be shot. They do not have the same rights as uniformed soldiers but McCain wouldn’t acknowledge that.
John McCain is trying to be all things to all people. He thinks he has the right in his pocket and he is pandering to the left like all hell trying to get the dem vote. He is going to fail miserably because it’s obvious he doesn’t stand for anything but whatever will get him elected. He is not like, believed or honest. He’s gonna make Mondale look good.
By the way, a centrist is a person who, believing they are better than both sides, is not willing to pick a team, stands in the middle and gets it from both sides, then crows about their loyalty to themselves.
Whippet:
Oh Please, if there was some conservative Idol out there who was going to save us all, where was he and where were the hordes of conservatives voting for him? A few Democrats could not overwhelm a lot of Republicans in their own primaries. For heavens sake, the closest to McCain in the primaries was Huckabee and the pundits and bloggers and self styled leaders of the conservative movement hated him as much as they did McCAin. So do not talk to me about naive. I am not the one who is in denial here.
I remember Reagan, I was on the farm back then. I remember the real amnesty vote, I remember he promised to shut down the Dept. of Education and did not, I remember he raised payroll taxes on Social Security. I can also remember Iran/Contra and the crash of the stock market and the farm crisis. I do not remember the man that so many on the right have invented to take the place of the real Reagan.
Reagan was human, just like Bush and McCAin. And lucky for him there was not a big talk radio contingent back then and the internet did not exist. Otherwise Novak might be calling him a “failed” president like he does Bush. Noonan might claim he has destroyed the party, like she says Bush did. And someone like Malkin might say he is the first Mexican president of the United States for signing an amnesty deal.
The biggest change over the years, has not been in the leaders, it has been in the pary itself. Back then they did some whining but they were not so adept at eating their own.
So now, the whining will be transferred from Bush onto McCain and we can listen to the same crap, different president. With friends like this, Republican presidents do not need enemies.
After all, the last time the conservatives got a real conservative in the White House was Bush and then they worked side by side with the Democrats to help wreck the man. Into his second term they announced that he was not a REAL conservative and that was that.
Maybe those primaries voters decided there was just no pleasing some people and decided it was time to try something different. Whatever the case, it is not McCAin’s fault or the Democrats’ fault if the GOP could not field a candidate that their people were not madly in love with.
And if I remember correctly Kos was telling people to cross over in Michigan because the Democrats were not going to be counting their primary there…and McCain lost that primary.
Terrye, for all your caterwalling, you fail to address this one hugh point, people DON”T LIKE MCCAIN!!!! From EITHER party! You can delude yourself by thinking they will hate the other guy more, but if that’s all you got to go on in a presidential election, you are in serious trouble!
The reason Mcnasty got the nomination is because the pro-amensty junta in the GOP manuevered the liberal open primary states up front to make it hard for a real conservative to win. That’s a fact Terrye! Look it up! And as far as voting for McCain, he got a pitiful small percentage of the vote, he was just lucky because most people split their vote for one of his four contenders and that weakened them.
And by the way Terrye, the way that you talk about Reagan reveals who you really are, you are a liberal dem thru and thru! Reagan only went along with the amnesty deal because democrats promised they would seal the border and they did what democrats do, they lied! And the economy was in hell before he came into office and it was in heaven when he left! You don’t remember that? I do! And also Terrye, when Reagan was in office, the percentage of illegals in the US of the total population was about less than one percent. Now it is over ten percent and growing. It’s a whole different situation but you are still in denial that it is a hugh problem! You don’t have the smarts that god gave a duck!
It is obvious to me that you and AJ and all your pro-illegal buddies on this site don’t have one god damned bit of concern for this country! All you seem to be bent on is importing tens of millions more mexicans into this country for whatever reason you have and you aren’t really that subtle about it! I don’t give a damn why you want to do that, all I know is that it is the most destructive thing that is ever going to happen to this country. We are devolvling into a third world state. You may not see that from your country club or gated community yet, I don’t even think you care. You are leftists. Leftists don’t love America for what it is, they think of what they want to turn it into.
How stupid it is for people not to understand that if millions of mexicans are leaving mexico and coming here, that we are going to become more like mexico. DO YOU GET THAT TERRYE??? Yet all you and AJ do is bitch about the fact that there are so many of us who are opposed to that!
Bush was not the last conservative in the White House, Reagan was! Even Bush Sr. was not that conservative and that’s why he lost! Noonan was right, Bush Jr. did destroy the party and he should rot in hell for it! McCain is worse. Has it ever occured to you that the only people you read about supporting him enthusiastically are former or present dems plus a few gutless weasels who call themselves centrists? He is going to get whipped like cream! And thank you idiotic moderates and libs for that! Personnaly, I don’t really think Obama or Hill could do more damage to the country than Juan. He is a senile idiot. But the congress is much more likely to challenge the dems.
With the rise of the internet and talk radio, there are many who will exploit emotions for their ratings. Not saying ALL are doing this, just some.
There are only two candidates: McCain and Obama. One is INFINITELY worse for America than the other. That one is the most liberal senator in the senate. That one has friends in places that DO NOT LIKE AMERICANS. They want to take you money and your lifestyle and make you suffer as they have suffered (their perception). The day will be rued that this is allowed to happen. These people are the antithesis of what makes America great.
If one calls staying at home acceptable, knowing the above, then I say one is the same as the above: America-haters. And believe me, there are many who, in their resentment, want Americans to suffer.
They won’t do things to make THEIR lives better, they just want to take away from those who are happy and successful. They are called covert hostiles. And in the work force, consultants advise that they be fired immediately. They will never change or are interested in changing.
Misery loves miserable company. THIS is what is being exploited by many, many pundits today…and politicians.
This campaign year will NOT be about substance. It will be about STYLE., NOT because we have made it so, HOLLYWOOD, the media and the democrats have crafted a guy who is nothing but style. But they know that is what motivates many Americans today. Do not blame McCain. He HAS to do things to win that battle while keeping his integrity.
Conservativs can stop debating ideas (we all know what the ideas are)and start debating HOW TO WIN. And that includes having the best answers to problems, but it will take MORE than that to win.