Sep 18 2007

Islam Reacts To Saudi Cleric’s Repudiation Of Bin Laden, al-Qaeda Keeps On Killing Muslims

Published by at 8:38 am under All General Discussions,Bin Laden/GWOT

The Muslim world is in the midst of deciding what to do with al-Qaeda, Bin Laden and all their horrific artrocities they are still inflicting on Muslims in Iraq. As I posted yesterday a renowned Islamist Cleric in Saudi Arabia had penned a repudiation of Bin Laden:

A Saudi Islamist former dissident and prominent cleric has slammed Al Qaeda chief Osama bin Laden for the killing of innocent people including children, his first such attack on the West’s most wanted man.

‘How many innocent people, elderly men and children have been killed and displaced under the Al Qaeda banner? Would you be happy to meet God carrying the burden (of their death) on your shoulders?’ Shaikh Salman Al Odah said in a ‘message to bin Laden’ posted on his website, islamtoday.

There is much more and links in the previous posts to read all the cleric said. It is a devastating assessment of al-Qaeda. Now we get to see some initial responses from others in the Muslim community to this repudiation of al-Qeada:

The letter in which Saudi preacher Dr. Salman Al Ouda attacked Al-Qaeda’s Bin Laden on the “cornerstone” program broadcast by the “MBC” channel has caused a wide range of reactions in Islamic circles.

A number of fundamentalist websites sympathetic to or supportive of Bin Laden saw in Al Ouda’s letter as a deviation from the “neutrality” he had been known for. Other websites said Al Ouda was late in taking his stand opposing “terrorism” and “the harm (It’s done) to the image of Islam and Muslims.”

Well, it seems people noticed at least. But al-Qaeda and its sympathizers need to tread carefully here. If they try to attack this messenger they may find themselves outside the Muslim mainstream and viewed as vile slanderers of Islam. Note, this cleric is no pro-Western voice, he still sees Bin Laden as Muslim without real sin:

Al Ouda said when Asharq Al-Awsat contacted him by telephone yesterday that he has received many positive reactions backing his stand and his appeal to Bin Laden and also received reactions from some whose messages he said carried “hidden” sympathy for Al-Qaeda and in which they said they were emotionally affected by the call.

According to Al Ouda, these reactions disagreed with the Islamic preacher for calling Osama Bin Laden “my brother Osama”, but the Saudi Muslim cleric said he has no problem with this and added, that “We are all humans. No matter how much we disagree with any person regardless of his approach, we cannot remove him from the circle of Islam, unless he commits a sin of unbelief.”

This actually makes his repudiation all the more powerful and hard for al-Qaeda to dismiss or ignore. And he has a point that cannot be easily dodged.

Al Ouda said in his televised letter that the image of Islam today is not at its best and the people all over the world say Muslims kill those who do not believe in their religion and also say that Salafism kills Muslims who do not believe in it.

Well, al-Qaeda promised violence and bloodshed during this Muslim Holy Month of Ramadan – and they are killing Muslims in great numbers, as they promised:

Three car bombs exploded in central and eastern Baghdad, police said.

The first two bombs detonated in a parking lot near Baghdad’s health ministry in the central district of Bab al-Muazzam. The attack was the most intense, killing 11 people and wounding 30.

Initial reports said seven people were killed and 23 wounded, but the dead and injured tolls were adjusted later.

The third car bomb exploded just minutes later in the eastern Zayouna neighbourhood, killing two people and wounding five.

In another attack in the Zaafaraniyah suburb, southern Baghdad, a blast near a police patrol killed a civilian and wounded two others.

In Baquba, 60 kilometres north of Baghdad, three Iraqi members of the same family were gunned down and two wounded in an armed attack on their vehicle, said the police.

In eastern Baquba, a civilian was killed and three members of the newly-formed Baquba Salvation Front were wounded in a mortar shell attack, the source of which was unknown.

al-Qaeda is at war with the Muslim communities of Iraq. A war they are losing. Because, while they can kill, they can never control and will never be allowed to lead. And in the end they will be decimated long before the Muslim street is decimated. They just don’t have the numbers to control Iraq (heck, we might not have the numbers if the population rose up against us). Iraqis are swearing on the Koran to destroy al-Qaeda after all the atrocities they have committed and continue to commit at this very hour. There is no turning this one around. al-Qaeda has lost Iraq. It is about to lose a lot more if that Saudi cleric is any example of what is coming across Islam.

18 responses so far

18 Responses to “Islam Reacts To Saudi Cleric’s Repudiation Of Bin Laden, al-Qaeda Keeps On Killing Muslims”

  1. Soothsayer says:

    Some questions from Nathan Gonzales (author of Engaging Iran: The Rise of a Middle East Powerhouse and America’s Strategic Choice (Praeger SI), and founder of, an open-source foreign policy think tank) about our ally, Saudi Arabia; and our enemy, Iran. ? Which is it, Iran (our enemy) or Saudi Arabia (our friend)?

    An environmentalist might ask:
    Which of the two countries (Iran or Saudi Arabia) is part owner of the second largest reserve of clean-burning natural gas in the world?


    A counter-terrorism official might ask:
    From which country do al-Qaeda-friendly jihadists sneak in to Iraq to kill Americans and indiscriminately bomb crowded Iraqi markets?

    Saudi Arabia

    A member of AIPAC might ask:
    Which country has gone to war with our ally Israel numerous times?

    Saudi Arabia

    An Islamic reformist might ask:
    Which country embraces an Islamic concept called “ijtihad,” or religious reasoning, which allows for modern interpretations of Islamic law, even legislation?


    An Iraqi-American might ask:
    Which country wants to see the Iraqi government succeed, to the point where it sends money and arms to the militias that prop it up?


    A conservative Christian might ask:
    Which country accepts Christianity as a state-sanctioned religion and guarantees its Christian community seats in parliament?


    Someone who hates theocracy might ask:
    In which country are the people tired of “Islamic” governance, since, rather than seeing it as an opposition movement, they associate it with a corrupt, self-interested elite?


    An Afghan-American might ask:
    Which country had a policy of regime change against the Taliban?


    Which country was one of only three to recognize the Taliban while Osama bin Laden was given refuge by them?

    Saudi Arabia

    A democrat (yes, lower-case “d” democrat) might ask:
    In which country do we see contested elections between diverse factions, and which, to a degree, represent popular will?


    An ordinary American might ask:
    Which country has a more pro-American population?

    Iran, several times over

    A really concerned American might ask:
    Which country has one of the more anti-American populations in the world?

    Saudi Arabia

  2. Cobalt Shiva says:

    You forgot the biggest question of them all:

    Which country has been in a de facto and de jure state of war with the United States since November 4th, 1979, as a matter of official national policy?


  3. Soothsayer says:

    You forgot a couple more BIG questions:

    Which country had a commerical airliner shot down by the USS Vincennes, killing all 290 passengers and crew aboard, including 38 non-Iranians and 66 children ( the Vincennes was inside Iranian territorial waters at the time)? This was during the Iraq/Iran war in which we supported then ally/later evil mass murderer Saddam Hussein.


    Which country did Oliver North trade surface-to-air missiles with in order to illegally finance Iran-Contra?


  4. Cobalt Shiva says:

    Which country had their naval forces attack US warships in international waters, had them run away like scared children when the US ships returned fire and gave pursuit, and simultaneously vectored commercial air traffic directly over an ongoing naval battle, resulting in (allegedly) 290 deaths?


    There is, BTW, a reason I say “allegedly.”

    At the time that the shootdown occured, I was assigned to a Marine Corps Search and Rescue helicopter unit in Beaufort, South Carolina.

    One ugly little fact that isn’t generally known outside the SAR community is that it’s utterly pointless to serach for bodies at sea until 48 hours after death, because rigor mortis causes bodies to sink, and it takes 48 hours of decomposition to generate sufficient gas in the corpse to make it float.

    CNN was showing footage from Iranian television less than 24 hours after the shootdown–footage of corpses floating in the water. Beautiful propaganda footage to revive the spirits of a nation that was flagging in its support of a pointless jihad that was not against no-kidding infidels, but against Muslims who didn’t also happen to speak Farsi. And dhimmi like you can be relied on to not question anything that your Islamist masters put out.

    The Iranian government has chosen to be at war with the United States for almost 30 years. Yes, when one insists on shooting at people, even the most restrained among them may sometimes choose to shoot back. Deal with it.

  5. I was aboard the COMIDEASTFOR Flagship at the time, and the USS Vincennes, was CATEGORICALLY NOT INSIDE Iranian Territorial Waters at the time of the Airbus Shootdown!

    Another “Bootlicker” LIE EXPOSED; ONCE AGAIN!

  6. Terrye says:

    Good grief. Soothsayer hates his country so much that he will suck up to a bunch of holocaust denying fascists just to make sure he is in opposition. This is exactly why Democrats lose in presidential elections.

  7. Soothsayer says:

    Save your lies, Dale:

    The Pentagon and White House defended the action, claiming the aircraft was outside the commercial jet flight corridor, flying at only 7,000 feet, and on a descent toward the Vincennes. One month later, U.S. authorities admitted that both the Vincennes and the airbus had been within a recognized commercial flightpath, and that the Iranian jet was flying at 12,000 feet and not descending. The U.S. Navy’s final report blamed crew error.

    Click here to see just how much full%20story“>crap Dale is full of.

    Further, several contradictions exist in the telling of the events surrounding the attack on Flight 655. U.S. Navy Capt. Will C. Rogers III had received orders earlier to stay in a position where the Vincennes could monitor the movement of the Iranian gunboats. When the Vincennes fired on the Iran Air flight, claiming that it was four miles outside of the standard commercial flight path from Bandar Abbas airport in Iran to Dubai, in the United Arab Emirates, records show that the Vincennes was actually inside of Iran’s territorial waters, not forty miles south (where the ship had been ordered by fleet headquarters to stay) as Rogers and government reports had claimed. Furthermore, Flight 655 was directly inside of its commercial flight path, not four miles outside of it–as Rogers and the Vincennes crew also claimed.

  8. Cobalt Shiva says:


    Try again yourself.

    The airliner was on the very edge of the 20-mile-wide international air traffic corridor (i.e., 10 miles from the centerline; if you think that’s how air traffic control should work in the real world, you’re saying you’re copacetic with a very high midair collision rate), and was routed over an ongoing naval battle by the air traffic controllers at Bandar Abbas–which was a dual-use airfield (i.e., the controllers were military personnel and had to know that a battle was in progress). It repeatedly ignored warning calls. Again, the Islamic Republic of Iran has been at war with the United States since November 4th, 1979–almost a decade before this incident. I guess a certain class of idiot–namely, you–needs a certain number of people killed–in the four-figure range–before you deign to notice no-kidding acts of war against America; even then, you seek to legitimize the enemy at the expense of your own country.

  9. Soothsayer says:

    Cobalt, Cobalt. Do some research. The warning calls were transmitted on the wrong frequency by the Vincennes. Further, in 1992, Admiral Wiliam Crowe admitted that the Vincennes was inside Iranian territorial waters.

    You’re just a pathetic ignorant fool with no data supporting your knee-jerk beliefs. Get some facts, chump:

    The airliner appeared on the Vincennes’s radar at 10:17, and at 10:19, the Vincennes began to issue warnings on the Military Air Distress frequency. According to U.S. government accounts, Vincennes mistakenly identified the Iranian airplane as an attacking military fighter. The Vincennes tried more than once to contact Flight 655, but there was no acknowledgement. The official ICAO report stated that these attempts to contact Iran Air 655 were sent on the wrong frequency and addressed to a non-existent “Iranian F-14”.

    The Iranian F-14s at Bandar Abbas have been set to squawk in “Mode II,” a mode that would identify to the U.S. ships that the aircraft in question were military, and Iranian. Being a commercial flight, Iran Air 655 was instructed to squawk in Mode III, a signal that identifies civilian traffic. A unique transmission code number, 6760 in this case, was assigned to distinguish this particular flight from others.

    During the next three minutes, the Vincennes issued a number of warnings on both military and civil distress frequencies, it (mistakenly) identified the Airbus 320 as a possible Iranian F-14, it (mistakenly) reported hearing IFF squawks in Mode II, and it (mistakenly) reported the aircraft as descending toward the ship when it was in fact still climbing according to its usual flight plan.

  10. Bootlicker: TRY AGAIN Anti-American Leftist Nutbag!



    I was the IWO that day, aboard the USS Coronado; the Flagship of COMIDEASTFOR, which at that time, was the senior command in AOR.

    I was also there for the six months bracketing that date; and the unfortuante aftermath.

    I was there for the CENTCOM Investigation, which began the day after; I was there when the Offical Report was done, and I READ IT!

    I also contributed to it, UNDER OATH; which is something you would know nothing about, things such as Honor and Integrity and Values and Morals and Ethics; because you’re an Anti-American/Pro-Jihadi Leftist NUTBAG!


    I was there early in the morning, came on watch at 7am that morning, was there thru the entire event!

    I like the History Channel, watch it all they time, they do good stuff usually; if I hadn’t have been there, I wouldn’t be able to question their “controversial” report, which in the article you linked to, it admits there’s discrepancies in the stories!

    But not from my side; the USS Vincenne’s helicopter was dispatched to watch the IRGC Boghammers, who had been attacking Oil Tankers down at the entrance to the Gulf for days; the IRGC Boghammers were violating UAE & Omani national waters, to attack the Oil Tankers, not the other way around.

    The Boghammers fired on the Vincennes’ Helo, with a Machinegun.

    Capt Rogers ordered 40 rounds of 5 inch Naval Gunfire fired at the offending Boghammer; heard the entire thing myself over the SPRAC!

    I know where the Vincennes was at the time, I was there when Adm Tony Less was notified, and came on the Bridge, along with the J2 & the N2, my bosses, and the Deputy of COMIDEASTFOR, who was an Air Force 1 BG.


    There was NEVER a question of the USS Vincennes violating Iranian Territorial waters, nor actually being INSIDE the Flightpath!

    If that WAS the case, and I WAS THERE; this is the FIRST TIME, in 19 years, that I’ve heard of it!

    And it’s funny, I brief this incident, at a Classified level for several years afterwards, to MANY audiences, and I never heard what you alleged before!

    I was aboard the Vincennes, within days afterwards, interviewing the Intel people, it was NEVER mentioned that what you alledge!


    So, I’m just curious, how an Anti-American, Pro-Jihadi, Leftist Nutbag, who has never been anywhere, and never done anything, and who’s only source of information on anything in the whole world, is Google, and her own hate for her own country, can know so much; when those people were there, and actually DID IT, are somehow, mysteriously “wrong”!

    The Airbus shootdown was a tragic mistake; of a crew that was eager to prove itself in battle, and a crew and Captain, that in light of the USS Stark and USS Robert’s incidents months earlier, erred, incorrectly, on the side of caution (in this regard, actually firing on the “target”), and unfortunately innocent people died.

    It was tragic, terrible, and it should NOT have happened; but it did; I was not pleased, I was pissed off; but I also know that no one did it on PURPOSE, it was heat of battle bad decision making.

    I do believe, that Capt Rogers regardless, should’ve been relieved, and several of this senior officers should also have been reprimanded.

    Not because they did it on purpose, but because they were “responsible” in the Military way of things.

    But, I was an 0-3 at the time, and the Chain of Command, mainly because of the President, did not take that approach.

    I’d have done it differently, but it was not my call.

    That said, it still does not change the facts, and your allegations, as always, are Bogus!

  11. Cobalt Shiva says:

    The airliner appeared on the Vincennes’s radar at 10:17, and at 10:19, the Vincennes began to issue warnings on the Military Air Distress frequency.

    Which, given that (a) they were in a running gunfight that was started by the Iranians (b) that Bandar Abbas was a dual-use airfield, and (c) that the aircraft was being vectored from said dual-use airfield directly toward said ongoing naval engagement, was perfectly reasonable.

    BTW, there was a strange thing that happened in the Gulf both before and after that incident . . . Iran Air monitored both Guard channels, not just the civilian one.

    The one time Iran Air didn’t do that was the one time they just happened to get sent over an ongoing shoot-out with an area AAW ship.

    Either that was the unluckiest coincidence in the entire Gulf, or . . .

    BTW . . . how do you explain the floating corpses being recovered more than 24 hours before they’d start to float if they’d died in the shootdown?

    The Iranian F-14s at Bandar Abbas have been set to squawk in “Mode II,” a mode that would identify to the U.S. ships that the aircraft in question were military, and Iranian.

    Wrong answer. Mode II will only generate a squawk if it receives the correct interrogation signal–i.e., if interrogated by a friendly unit with the correct crypto for that net. The Iranian F-14s were not friendly. Nice try.

    Being a commercial flight, Iran Air 655 was instructed to squawk in Mode III, a signal that identifies civilian traffic. A unique transmission code number, 6760 in this case, was assigned to distinguish this particular flight from others.

    Uh-huh. That’s nice. You mind explaining why the nice military air traffic controllers at Bandar Abbas just happened to vector a civilian airliner toward the one and only ongoing naval battle in the entire freakin’ Gulf?

    Iran went out of their way to make this event happen, and they did so while in a state of war and actively engaged in hostilities against the United States. When one has that confluence of events, really bad stuff is going to happen, and complaining about does nothing useful, unless you’re an Islamist or a dhimmi.

  12. Soothsayer says:

    Who cares if you were there. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Admiral Crowe ADMITTED on nationwide TV that the VIncennes was in Iranian waters. Whether or not you WERE THERE . . . there is one variable that does not change: You’re CLUELESS.

    The official DoD Report
    admits the Montgomery, the Sides and the Vincennes were in Iranian territoral waters.

  13. Cobalt Shiva says:

    Admiral Crowe ADMITTED on nationwide TV that the VIncennes was in Iranian waters.

    Interesting. You cite flag officers as unimpeachable authorities–but only when they agree with you. If you don’t agree with them, they’re merely running dog infidel lackeys of the warmongering Zionist neocons.

    BTW . . . what is the relevance of the ships being in Iranian waters? Do you believe that this some sort of silly game where the Iranians get to shoot at US warships and aircraft, but become immune to counterattack if they manage to cross an imaginary line on a map?

  14. ivehadit says:

    Soothie is a light weight. He was in George W.’s box at a baseball game…but I know Mike nor George invited him!

  15. Sory NUTBAG, WRONGO!

    Admiral Crowe said a lot of BS that we just used to shake our heads at, and wonder what planet he was from?

    No surprise there, he’s a freaking Democrat anyhow!

    Vincennes, NOR it’s Helo, ever went into Iranian waters, I was on the Taccom with them during the engagement, I specifically asked them that question, and I had CENTCOM screaming in my ear on the other lines, asking what the hell was going on!

    Your link to that report is LAUGHABLE!

    You’re basing your conclusions, on the conclusions in the Yellow boxes, by another of your fellow Anti-American/Pro-Jihadi Leftwing Nutbags, who sprinkles their “analysis” of the Original report, with such UNBIASED analysis as this:

    “The recklessly negligent failure of senior U.S. Military Officers to require their warship radio-talkers to speak the transponder squawk-code, when seeking to broadcast to a target aircraft, is a prima facie proximate cause of the ambush.

    An excellent criminal motive for senior U.S. Military Officers to conceal, from their deceitful report, the text of the recklessly negligent talking script, which they issued to their warship radio-talkers.:

    Ah, yeah!

    No wonder you’re in love with your pet LIE theory, you got one of your fellow NUTBAGS, analyzing it!

    No wonder YOU believe it!


    Sorry NUTBAG, I WAS THERE, you were sitting at home, abusing yourself with a bottle of handlotion, while watching the Disney Channel!

    Your pal’s analysis (no surprise), is ot only WRONG, but the typical Anti-American crap that we know and love about Traitors like you!

    Admiral Crowe also said, later on that the decision to “fire” had been sent from the Vincennes, to us at the Flagship, to CENTCOM, to the Pentagon, to the NSC/JCS to the President, where he approved it, and it went all the way back that channel, in less than SEVEN minutes, and that’s why the Vincennes reacted so quickly, and fired on the Boghammers!

    That was a complete and UTTER fabrication on Crowe’s part; he lived in a fantasy land; that incident, as relayed by him, NEVER HAPPENED!

    In fact, frankly, the Vincennes NEVER asked permission to fire on the Boghammers from COMIDEASTFOR, in the first place!


    Capt Rogers heard the report that his Helo had been fired on, took the initiative, and fired the 40 rounds of 5inch gunfire on their own!

    I KNOW, I was there; the first that ANYONE on the Flagship had heard they fired on the Boghamers, is when ME/MYSELF/I on the Bridge heard the CIC from the Vincennes say “40 rounds expended!”

    I picked up the radio and said “What did you just say, this is the IWO on the Coronado?”

    The person on the other end got defensive, I could tell from his voice, and he said “We fired 40 rounds of 5inch at the Boghammers, they fired on our Helo”!

    I yelled into the Radio “Who gave you permission to fire?”

    They got real quite, and that’s when I sent someone to get Admiral Less, and the bridge filled up, and it was all hell breaking lose.

    The fact is, Vincennes NEVER asked permission, they did it on their own, sorry to say!

    I put that in my Official Statement, along with some other things that were “wrong”, from my perspective.

    Whether anyone paid any attention, I don’t know, but I reported it.

    So yeah, the Vincennes, and their Capt, and some of the crew, did wrong things, and covered it up; I’ve told people that for 19 years!

    I’ve given briefs on it; to selected audiences!

    But Admiral Crowe is the LAST person who knows what happened there that day, and his public comments have shown that for 19 years as well.

    But just because Capt Rogers and some of his crew made mistakes, doesn’t mean they shot the Airbus down on purpose (they didn’t, and I KNOW that for a FACT!), and it also doesn’t put them in Iranian territorial waters, which they WERE NOT!

    So GOOGLE all you like little WORM, you don’t have a CLUE; I WAS THERE, you were home, dry humping your moma’s leg!

    Get a life, Traitor!

  16. Lurker: actually, the report says two things I personally disagree with:

    a) the Vincennes was in Iranian territorial waters…

    b) the Vincennes asked for permission to shoot at the Boghammers, and then for permission to shoot down the Airbus…

    They claim in this report, to have it on Videotape, and computer tapes, that the Vincennes crossed into Iranian Territorial waters.

    That is the FIRST time in 19 years, that I’ve ever heard that.

    There was NEVER any question, onboard the Flagship, while I was there, that the Vincennes was in Iranian Territorial Waters.

    This report was written by a Marine, and not some comments on a Declassified report, by a clearly Anti-American commentator who must be “Bootlicker’s” brother.

    I’m willing to concede, that after 19 years, I may be wrong on that issue, if this Marine says there is Video and Computer tape proof that the Vincennes was in Iranian territorial waters.

    What I will NOT change my opinion on, as I was just about the ONLY one standing on the bridge at the time, and heard all the Comms, was the fact that the Vincennes asked for Permission to fire on the Boghammer’s!

    That just did not happen, and I can only assume that that is fiction, created and maintained by the Chain of Command, to cover up for Rogers.

    The fact is, Capt Rogers, of the USS Vincennes, was a loose cannon; that was known in-theater, from the first day the Vincennes arrived!

    He was out of control, and a loose cannon; and we actually had a member of the Intel Staff, PREDICT that the Vincennes would shoot down a COMAIR out of Bander Abbas, within days of the Vincennes arriving in-theater, because they were out of control.

    Additionally, as that report you linked to shows Lurker, it was not only the Capt Carlson, of the USS Sides, who was critical of Capt Rogers of the Vincennes, Capt’s of the other US warships in the Gulf were also leery of Capt Rogers, and the way he did business.

    All that said, despite the obvious screw-ups, and despite the obvious mistakes, it was not a “deliberate” attempt to shoot down the Airbus.

    But, the innocent people aboard, were dead just the same.

    Capt Rogers should’ve been relieved; and he should’ve been court-martialled in my opinion, or officially reprimanded at a minimum.

    Additionally, Admiral Crowe was the least qualified person, to comment upon this incident, as his subsequent comments have been pointed out in the report; he was clueless then, he’s clueless now.

    Also, frankly, at the time, I remember George Bush Sr’s comments; and there was no doubt in the minds of many of us, that whether he knew the truth or not, he certainly was “spinning” things, to mitigate the political impact upon him.

    This was not the only time he did this; later on, when the US Navy shot down the two Libyan MIG’s in the Gulf of Sidra, he came out and said he had looked at all the evidence, and he had decided that the pilots had acted in self-defense.

    Again maybe he knew, maybe he didn’t.

    But I was also on the Intel side of that little problem as well, and I can tell you, the F-14 pilots involved in that were also out wild-catting, and they shot down the two Libyan MIG’s without provocation, and lied about it!

    Anyway, none of this is either here nor there; regardless, “Bootlicker” is still a Liar, a Fraud, a Cheat, and an Anti-American/Pro-Jihadi Leftist Nutbag Traitor; that is one, immutable FACT!