Aug 15 2006
From The Duh! Files
Lot’s of talk about Syrian and Iranian declarations of victory for Hezbollah over Irsrael (signs of the victory abound here, here, here and here). But what is truly wild is how the Syrian and Iranian declarations are seen as somehow a failure of the Bush administration’s policies to turn the ME from a cesspool of hate into a region ripe with freedom and potential through democratization. The two last serious strong men standing are claiming they are the proper model of the future ME and somehow this is seen as a setback for democracy? What did these ‘big thinkers’ in DC and around the world think these last oppressive states would do? Did they think they would just say “damn, you were right W – we should just go set up democracies”? The cornered animals are lashing out as their pawns were dismantled and the UN is finally ridding Lebanon of Assad Bathists and Syrian Control. Of course these fools in Damascus and Tehran are declaring victory. I am just stunned how many people are believing it!
![here](http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/060723/ids_photos_ts/r823019893.jpg"){kind=link}
These people always declare victory. We are like Pavlov’s dogs. We just keep rising to the bait. We do cartoons, they riot and burn flags. They get their asses kicked, they declare victory.
As for Bush being responsible for the problems in the Middle East, well what was their excuse before? Sometimes Assad and Ahmanmadman sound like the Democrats, don’t they?
We should fly a sign behind an air plane saying YOUR VICTORY IS TYRANY HOW DO YOU LIKE IT?
I guess they didn’t get the memo
1984 doublespeak has come and gone
It’s soooooooooo yesterday
Dear Terrye and AJS Trata.
Can you please kindly point to us where has Mr. Bush created a Democracy?. Please don’t make the mistake to say Iraq. By Bush’s own standards Iraq does not qualify. In one of Bush’s press conferences he declared that Libanon can’t be considered a true Democracy (He used to say otherwise) with Hezbollah fully armed, and serving as political party in Lebanon at the same time.
I could not agree with Mr. Bush more. Problem is that in Iraq we have exactly the same situation with Shiite Militias, and the Kurd’s Pashmerga Militia (60,000 strong) . But here Mr. Bush and his Administration have no problems calling Iraq a Democracy!!
Now that my friends is what I call spin!!
Iraq is in a slow motion cilvil war, Libanon, that just this time last year was Bush’s show case for “The advances of Freedon and Democracy” is now in the black list, Syria, Iran, Egypt, The Sudan, Libia, Moroco, Saudi Arabia, Quatar, Jordan, etc, etc.
See any Democracies in those countries?
I don’t know about good policies, all I know is that I don’t see any Democracies. I am a show me kind of man. Bush is not showing me a darn thing.
I would apreciate if you start giving your beloved Bush so much slack, and ask for some RESULTS for a change. Not Bull shit excuses.
Gil,
Maybe you should familiarize yourself with the definition of a democracy and sort of compare that to Saddam’s reign. Maybe then you may be a able to grasp a bit of the difference. Otherwise, I am afraid you are a classic liberal! Which is why you folks cannot be trusted to run a country.
AJStrata
ajstrata.
I am still waithing for you (or any one) to name ONE Democracy created to justify for our troubles in the Middle East. Do not change the subject.
Sadam was not a Democracy? Why is that any of our business?
We change Sadam at a cost of hundreds (and counting) of billions of dollars, and the loss of thousands of lives for what? No WMD’s, No Al-Quaida( in those days), and NOW NO DEMOCRACY. In short Mr. AJStrata we changed a Mad Dictator for a Mad Bunch of Mullas!! At least, last I checked Sadam was NOT killing any Americans, or making us spend hundreds of billios of dollars to “create a new Iraq” was he?
Besides. It is not my definition of a Democracy, as I pointed out is your love Bush’s definition. I just quoted him. Sorry if that offends your sensibilities.
LOL! Gil – go hold your breath. If you cannot see the difference then that is why you should avoid public debates on such issues. And in case your lacking in history, the Mullahs have been mad since Carter. Your not making Bush look bad! So come on back and post more reasons why the left is marginal on foreign policy – it\’s not going to bother me.
Ajstarta.
I am just pointing out to you the absolute lack of results of Bush’s policies in the Middle East. I am also pointing out to you that as bad as Sadam was, he never killed any Americans, never was involved with Al-Quaida or 9/11, and never made us spend hundreds of billions of dollars in stupid little crusades to “Free Iraq”. It is Bush’s decition making to take us to Iraq that has created the present situation NOT SADAM.
As in any policy private or public one has to look at the results as the logical process of forming a consensus of the results of such policy. Republicans tend to forget that part of logical thinking. You simply ignore results, or skip the demand for accountability for admited mistakes.
In the case of the Bush policy in Iraq, or the Middle East THERE ARE NO RESULTS TO SHOW.
You can talk all you want, and compose the world any way you want, in the end it is the RESULTS that count. That is why you still can’t tell me of any single Democracy that has been created as a result direct or indirect of our now 4 year (and counting) adventure in Iraq.
That is because there is none… As in no results, just a lot of talk.
As for your comment of my lack of understanding of the difference in a Democracy; For the third time IT WAS BUSH’S DEFINITION (not mine) of what a true Democracy should look like. That is to say A Democracy should not have armed political parties as is the case of Hezbollah in Libanon. I agree with Bush (don’t you?) . Problem is that the same is the case in Iraq, only here very convinently Bush calls Iraq a Democracy. A Democracy with a militia of more than 60,000 armed Pashmerga Kurds in the North?, a Democracy with tens of thousands of Shiite Militia that serve as private armys to a bunch of mad Mullas? (I don’t know about Carter’s Mullas, it is Bush’s Mullas the one that should worry us).
You don’t see a doble standard here?
The Democrats did not create this situation, Bush did. Why do you say that the left is marginal on foreign policy? Do they have a record on the Iraq mess? Last I checked the people in charge of our Foreign Policy are Bush’s appointees. The Democrats role out of power is limited to give opinions, and point out to the public the complete lack of results, and accountability of the Bush Administration, just as the Republicans would be doing if the mand in charge was a Democrat.
You see any goals been met in Bush Iraq and Middle East policies?
I am all ears, please name them.
Gil,
Are you just so blinded by BDS you have no idea about Saddam killing Americans and housing the terrorists who killed Americans? Like I said – keep coming back. Your the poster child for liberal ignorance.
Goals: Saddam dethroned, democratic government of Sunni, Shia and Kurds working together, Iraqis chasing down and killing terrorists, Iraqi’s not pursuing WMDs, Iraqis not threatening Kuwait and Saudi Arabia, … and so much more. You may be all ears, but you should try exercising what is between them.
Gee Gil. Get out much? Sorry dude, but three easy slaps and I am done with you. My time is best spent with important matters.
Cheers
Ajstrata.
Again. any Democracies formed?
And now several questions from this ignorant “Liberal” in response to your many wild remarks:
What Americans did Saddam killed that provoked the war? Please name one.
Saddam was housing the terrorist that killed Americans? what on earth are you talking about?. Name a single terrosist that Saddam was” housing” to kill Americans. Where?, When?
He can’t persue WMD’s ? What WMD’s were ever found? The Bush administration’s accomplished goal in your view, is for Saddam not to be allowed to persue WMD’s that he did not have? That is great logic indeed!!!
Can you please stop making statements and point to specifics?
I am the poster child of Liberal Ignorance? I am not even a Liberal.
Shiite, Kurds, and Sunni working together…. You have to be kidding!!
And you call me ignorant!! They have a Democracy…. Really, with tens of thousands of armed men running around killing each other as well as civilians you have one hell of a view of the way a Democracy looks like. Kind of like Hell on earth if you ask me. If that’s a Democracy pall, you can keep it.
Any answer on their militias? I suppose that in your eyes all the killing and infighting, is just “working together” and settling out some minor differences right?
How on earth do you rationalize a 60,000 armed Militia by the Kurds, and tens of thousands of Militia in the service of the Shiite, and tens of thousands in the service of the Sunni as “working together” while in fact they are having it out at each other every single day of the week. But I am the poster boy of delusion!!
Iraq was not tretening Saudi Arabia and Kuwait at the time of the invasion. Sadam had that war ten years BEFORE we invaded. The Saudi were very much against us staring a war in Iraq they did not feel any treat from Saddam, but from IRAN. Kuwait adviced us not to go. Talking about History you should check yours. Is rather recent by the way.
The only goal accomplished was Saddam going down. That goal is what created all our problems in the first place !!!