Jun 29 2007
Remember When All We Had To Do Was Enforce The Laws?
Like all good PR campaigns that are meant to create a mob-mentality approach, the sound bite is employed to make a complex issue seem so simple – even a caveman could do it. The truth is, sound bites are usually misleading or out and out lies. Seems we have been lied to – we can’t just enforce the laws – according to Malkin and others who said that was all we had to do:
The Executive Office for Immigration Review — a federal agency made up of the U.S. Immigration Court system and its appellate body, the Board of Immigration Appeals — is the centerpiece of a largely unknown permanent amnesty for illegal aliens and criminal alien residents within the U.S. Department of Justice.
With the complicity of the Department of Justice and the Department of Homeland Security, the EOIR litigation bureaucracy forms the hidden piece of the puzzle of institutionalized mass immigration in the federal government.
Deportation of foreign nationals in the United States is largely voluntary.
The lengthy EOIR system of hearings and appeals enables illegal aliens and criminal alien residents to remain in the United States both legally and illegally.
EOIR and the INS enable the vast majority of detained aliens facing deportation to be released back to the streets on an immigration bond or paroled out of federal custody during the EOIR hearing process, giving every non-detained illegal alien and criminal alien the option of disappearing back into the United States regardless of the outcome of their Immigration Court hearings.
…
Michelle Malkin agrees that the EOIR and BIA bureaucracy should be abolished — Book Review of “INVASION”
Yep folks, as I tried to warn everyone – we cannot simply enforce the laws. We need to rewrite them. Which was what the Bill would START to do. Again, thanks to Michelle and others we now are stuck with possibly a million illegal alien, convicted criminals on our streets for the foreseeable future. What a victory!
I forgot to add: It must be part of that diabolical Democrat plan to destroy the GOP that made these people mislead everyone – right? Credibility is fundamental in politics. A lot of loose cannons just shot the hell out of the GOP’s credibility and got us – NOTHING!
Update: Folks, I strongly suggest you read the comments. The hypochondriacs are now changing their stories. They knew all along existing laws would not work. Now one claims it was lack of paperwork to congress which drove him to stop the progress and another now says it was never going to work. But the best comment is from reader Crosspatch, who notes that this IS the legal process on the books. THEREFORE, any immigrant who is in this process IS LEGAL!
Yeah, been trying to tell people for a long time that there really is no law to enforce. There is no penalty for being here against regulations UNLESS you have already been deported and come back again by clandestine means. THEN it is a crime. But a person remaining here on a legitimate visa (about 50% of “illegalsâ€) faces no penalty other then *possible* deportation and that usually hinges on them waiving their hearing process. If they go through the hearing process, it can take years to be deported or they might simply be allowed to stay, particularly if they have children who are US citizens.
Legal process makes them legal. And since this is an unending process they can be here indefinitely. Ladies and Gentlemen – it was all a sham! The far right lied to you. We cannot do ANYTHING by simply enforcing the laws. It was a PR slogan. As I noted this was WELL KNOWN by the Amnesty Hypochondriacs. It is not silent amnesty to have torpedoed this bill. It was LEGAL AMNESTY! As long as this legal process is not overhauled – then these people are here LEGALLY if they follow the current process. Shamnesty? Someone’s glass house just shattered.
Them heavy clouds are hell, ain’t they?
Consider this, talking about how it is now:
“Deportation of foreign nationals in the United States is largely voluntary.”
Under the new law, it would have been non-existent.
and of course this: As it is now:
“The lengthy EOIR system of hearings and appeals enables illegal aliens and criminal alien residents to remain in the United States both legally and illegally.
While the new bill made them all legal, so they would only now stay legally.
A wolf in sheeps clothes, is still a wolf.
AJ
Regardless how you cut it we had 40 years of neglect.
The neglect was not just lack of enforcement of the laws on the books, but the greater lack was shear lack of oversight by governments on both sides of the aisle. There is plenty of blame to go around that would justify a bipartisan fix.
Instead today we have committees chasing phantom issues about firings in the Justice Department instead of in depth review of the real faults in the government makeup.
After the last amnesty it didn’t take long to observe it wasn’t working and the trends were there for all to see who chose to look.
So now it is time to pay the piper.
Merlin,
This is not neglect. This is a broken legal process – as Michelle CLAIMED herself.
LOL!
FE finally admits he was lying when he said all we had to do is enforce the laws!
Too funny. And his little fantasy about provisional status while the process works (you know, innocent until proven guilty (or in this case proven a felon)) is pure fiction. But we know have FE admitting enforcing the laws won’t work and he just didn’t think anything would work so he wanted the status quo. Stunning bit of ‘logic’ there.
AJ
It was neglect, oversight would have revealed the legal process was broken and needed to be fixed.
It could have been mended much earlier and never have grown to this proportion.
We went 40 years and all of a sudden everyone had a “come to Jesus” moment.
I for one don’t buy it.
Simply proper oversight would have discovered the problems and an early fix could have been crafted.
In fact thats what some suggested here related to the current bill.
Some said pass it with it’s faults and correct it later.
Well the exact same logic applied back then, however the oversight and the corrections were never done.
If anyone had taken the time to read the bill that just got shot down you would clearly see the only guidance issue in the whole bill was the triggers of dubious worth to enable portions of the bill.
There was absolutely zero provisions for down range reviews of the effectiveness of the bill effects.
No required two three or five year review, not a single effectiveness report to congress.
It was just set it and forget it.
All in all the same pattern of all the Kennedy originated bills.
All a lame smokescreen Merlin. And the results of your efforts?
There is absolutely zero provisions for down range reviews of the effectiveness of the bill effects. (few laws have these or need these, and they could have been added. Congress can review any time they want – see a law requiring Congress to get reports on status in Iraq?)
Nothing will be reviewed for two three or five years, not a single effectiveness report to congress.
Your result was as good as their solution – minus all the positive stuff that WAS in the bill. Nice job folks. Take a bow for NOTHING!
LOL! I don’t expect the hypochondriacs to see how ridiculous this all was and is. They didn’t see it coming and they will hold their blinders firm to avoid seeing what it left. Denial plain and simple.
Yeah, been trying to tell people for a long time that there really is no law to enforce. There is no penalty for being here against regulations UNLESS you have already been deported and come back again by clandestine means. THEN it is a crime. But a person remaining here on a legitimate visa (about 50% of “illegals”) faces no penalty other then *possible* deportation and that usually hinges on them waiving their hearing process. If they go through the hearing process, it can take years to be deported or they might simply be allowed to stay, particularly if they have children who are US citizens.
It is one reason why I have a problem with “illegal” because it really isn’t “illegal” unless you have been kicked out and came back.
The only report required was a unique new annual report of the number of deaths on the border.
No reports required of fence construction progress only a final certification.
No summary reports of border crashers caught, how many deported, how effective the added lawyer and personnel enhancements did.
It was simply a flying blind bill.
Only if someone chose to get the GAO and the CRS to do a study would anything be revealed.
This bill had no feedback loop in it of any consequence.
CP,
Notice how the hypochondriacs are now changing their tune! Now FE claims it was never about just enforcing the laws, it was all the ‘illegal’ immigrants (which you point out correctly are not ‘illegal’ since they are here per the legal process) becoming legal! And Merlin is now looking over at the lack of reporting as his reason. Yeah, the BS got so deep it stunk up the whole place.
People are talking about the GOP losing beaucops more votes to the Hispanic bloc but they miss the larger point.
There will ultimately be a “hard right” third party which will have to deal with the invasion. It might take another generation but by then
Pat Buchanan will look like a moderate conservative on the issue.
BFD Merlin. That is your latest lame excuse for doing nothing? Not enough paperwork back to Congress? The opponents cannot even defend their own victory! There is NOTHING now Merlin – thanks!
Take a bow. There were your marginal issues AND all the rest of the holes still there! Nothing is not better than something with some holes to fill in.
But you do admit we cannot simply enforce the laws because, as CP notes, these people ARE NOT HERE ILLEGALLY!! If they are in this endless LEGAL process then, guess what? They are following the law! And guess what, they can stay indefinitely!
LOL! The irony of this is just too stunning. The far right was all full of BS and empty claims.
AJ
Keep calling me any name you wish, I have a very thick skin.
I keep presenting issue you seem unable to dispute, except by extreme hand waving.
Yes Michelle pointed out the laws were broken.
Well guess what they didn’t break yesterday.
They were broken from the beginning, but we still managed to deport people in a lot of cases.
Catch and release was a problem. Do you think that just started yesterday?
Those are facts, no matter how hard you try, you can’t just wave your hands and make them go away.
AJ
I was opposed to the bill in its form and pointed out things that needed to be fixed.
I proposed in one of the threads to pass the individual bills which are already on the Senate floor to address the broken issues.
The comprehensive product was non workable in it’s form and that is part of the reason why it was defeated.
So tell me just what have you suggested besides passing another badly formed bill to make the situation work?
There are bills on the floor addressing specific issue in fact over 50 of them according to Thomas Legislative database.
Fixes can be done.
The only thing that is required is the will to do so.
What name did I call you other than “Merlin”?
I could have said something like ‘the paperwork protector’, or maybe provided you a slogan like “paperwork before progress!”.
The hangover from this has not yet even set in for the GOP. Not by a longshot.
Like I said early on, if we are going to battle over this then every zero sum result will be at a price to the GOP until they realize it is too politically damaging to stand in the way anymore.
What, don’t tell me you thought this issue was dead? LOL! Hell no. We have a little over a year to remind voters EVERY DAY what the GOP did and how they lied to America that all we had to do was enforce the laws.
And when the political pain becomes too much, and the hypochondriacs cry ‘uncle’ we will have the reform we need. I said this was going to come at a price Merlin. And for those of us who are dead serious about the importance of this bill to our national security there is no time to worry about bruised egos and damaged political parties.
I was quite clear as to my motivations. It still is national security. And right now the biggest obstacle is the GOP – not the dems.
Making it up as you go along.
At no time or place have I said:
I defy ANYONE to link to my stating the above.
The Losers were on the Losing side, the winners were on the winning side. Simple as that
You said
LOL! I don’t expect the hypochondriacs to see how ridiculous this all was and is. They didn’t see it coming and they will hold their blinders firm to avoid seeing what it left. Denial plain and simple.
Left by AJStrata on June 29th, 2007
It may not have been directly applied to me, but the reading of your response post could go either way.
Either way AJ, I am only trying to impartially point out the faults all along with the bill and few others could even without major generalization give good reasons to support the bill.
Right now the best thing congress and specifically the Senate can do is to take some of those individual bills I talked about and bring forward the ones that address the most eggregious problems that have been identified during this debate.
Single issue approaches can do a lot to fix the holes we all know exist and will not generate the ire this has done.
In fact since those bills in reality exist out there and the opportunity exists to enact them, if they choose to ignore that is only pile on shame to them.
I have to admit, FE. Your reactionary drivel is becoming quite comical. I can’t help but at least chuckle when I read your comments. Perhaps you are the reason for my pathological need to laugh. HA HA HA.
The opposition to this bill seemed to rest solely on the guest worker program (i.e., z-visas). They mislabeled this as mere amnesty and responded with enforcement first mantras.
What can we do about it now? Just vote in the next election I guess and unfortunately live with the consequences of not being able to control the hissyfitters.
CrossP,
Yeah, been trying to tell people for a long time that there really is no law to enforce. There is no penalty for being here against regulations UNLESS you have already been deported and come back again by clandestine means. THEN it is a crime.
Seems, as usual, you missed the point, along with AJ as he posted your manifesto of ignorance as an update.
It’s not the crime of coming illegally that we are talking about. It’s all the other crimes. You saying all criminals are entitled because they are here and should go thru the process. I say if you were a criminal before you came here, you’re not entitled to any legal status here. Too bad you couldn’t understand something so simple.