Jun 01 2007
Immigration Hypochondriacs Killing GOP
In a follow up to my post about how Noonan, and the others tyrannical right (and I mean that because if we other conservatives want something in an immigration Bill the far right does what it can so no one get’s anything but what they themselves want), we now have the far right killing off the party by withholding donations – which does nothing but help liberals get elected.
You heard yesterday that the RNC canned its in-house phone bank employees, partly due to an estimated 40% drop in small donations. Whoever they outsourced the job to is not gonna get those numbers back up.
I happened to be at my friend Emily Dunham’s house when the RNC called to see “at what level she was comfortable renewing her contribution.” It went a little something like this.
Ring, Ring
Emily: “Hello?’
Caller: “Hi, ma’am, this is the Republican National Committee calling.”
Emily (aside to me, with a big grin on her face): “It’s the RNC.”
Caller: “We’re just calling to see at what level you’d be comfortable renewing your contribution. Would $75 be all right?”
Emily: “How about nothing?”
Caller: “Oh, why’s that?”
Emily: “I’m not real happy with the immigration bill.”
We all KNOW liberals want to surrender to al Qaeda as soon as possible and dismantle the NSA surveillance program which monitors calls by known terrorists OUTSIDE this country to people inside the country. We all know this. And yet the tyrannical right is deliberately undermining our efforts in a hissy fit of paranoia at any progress whatsoever on immigration.
As I pointed out before the security enhancements, the ability to deport any immigrant (legal or illegal) for committing a crime (not for being illegal which takes time and too much process) and the ability to provide a tamper proof ID which employers must verify are ALL going to be defeated if the far right get has its way. I doubt it will. But when I said the far right better NOT blackmail this country with our security over this issue I was serious. Either lose gracefully or forget any coalitions in the future – just leave the party. Please. The far right is into punishing everyone who disagrees with them. Immigrant workers, conservatives, everyone. Take your marbles and go home.
And retire one more thing, my Grandmother lived in Oklahoma and I live in Indiana and that made the cutting the grass for her difficult and I said I did not know if the guy was legal or not, it was a decade ago and so far as I know people were sort of oblivious to the whole issue then. That might explain why Newt and his fellow Republicans in Washington did not include border enforcement in their Contract with America. Any more questions? Have I covered everything?
Terrye, only you in the north was oblivious to the problem of illegal immigration a decade ago. We here on the battle line have been screaming about it since the days of Eisenhower. But it was a southwestern problem then and no one was really listening. Now that it affects the entire nation, people are beginning to take notice. Funny how that works, when it is your neighborhood going to shit, you wake up.
Eisenhower took action against the illegals. So did LBJ. But then, there were not one million illegals in Pennslyvania so none of the elites in Washington really cared about the border states.
And remember all the promises we were made? How amnesty for almost 3 million in 1986 was going to fix the problem? Yeah, we here in Texas really bought into that crap. Now, 21 years later we have an additional 9-17 million. It was empty rhetoric then, it’s empty rhetoric now.
At least you are true to your leftist roots. That much I will give you.
Are you going to pay my tax bill?
Terrye,
Let me see if I understand you correctly: are you saying you think the new bill is better, even if it not enforced with any more vigor than current law? Because, that’s how I interpret the combination of support for the bill because you don’t think anything better is possible with a dismissal of our concerns about enforcement. That’s where we part company – if we’re not enforcing existing law and not going to implement the enforcement provisions of the new law, then I’d rather stay where we are and put my energies into enforcement.
Nazi style cattle cars? Oh come on. Time and again I hear people say load em up and ship em out. I am just saying that if we did that it would like the Nazis in those old film clips, imagine how people would react. I never said that you personally want to do that.
Maybe we all need to listen to ourselves from time to time so that we hear what others hear. That goes for myself as well
And the roofing story means what? That all Mexican roofers are late? Those kinds of stories are common among contractors of all kinds. If they had been legal they would probably still have been late because they were obviously unreliable.
See this what I mean, you bring up a Mexican serial killer, what am I supposed to say? BTK, Dahmer, John Wayne Gacey….would you rather be neighbors with them? And I understand the resentment about taxes, I feel a certain resentment when I am out there every day at the age of 55 working and I read somewhere that they have to put up signs offering sign up bonuses for people to work in a fast food restaurant in New Orleans because people won’t work.
I read in the WSJ that immigrants will pay more in social security taxes than they will collect. Is this true? I don’t know, but I know that not all these people are bad. That does not make me a bleeding heart. That is just common sense.
No Cato that is not what I said.
I said that I think the bill is better than nothing and I said that the people who don’t think it will be enforced will not be satisfied with any bill.
As for the laws not being enforced, it is something like Prohibition. It is not just a question of the government not enforcing the laws, it is a question of the people refusing to obey the laws. For instance, people say this is a crime like any other…but if people walked in a restaurant and saw a woman being assaulted most would call the law or try to intercede…but if they see a young hispanic male busing tables they don’t call the law. You can say it would do no good, but the truth is if people had called the law a few million illegals ago it would make a difference. People did not because they do not see this as a crime. You can argue that it is, but when the mayor LA can tell the local law enforcement not to work with INS and he is not run out of office by an outraged citizenry then obviously there is more to this than just some bad illegals preying on Americans. These people are here because a lot of Americans want them here and those Americans are not obeying the laws any more than those illegals are.
So if we make fines larger and throw in some jail time that might help. If we put more men and security on the border that might help. If we have a tamper resistant card that helps track people, that might help, if we drain that swamp of illegals either by deportation or legalization after a payment of a fine that might help as well.
It will not be something that will change overnight, it has gone on too long.
Terrye, your “cattle car” comment was direct at me, personally. No, my roofing story was to show that the sterotype of the hard working immigrant is partially smoke and mirrors.
And since you seem to not be able to grasp the point I made about Angel Resendez, I see no reason to IMPORT criminals when we have our own homegrown criminals.
As to Social Security benefits, it is proven that the lower the wages earned during a life time, the greater the benefits. Some will regain all they have paid into the system in less than four years. So in the long run, having a glut of low wage earners will hasten the demise of the Social Security fund, not prolong it. Are you even aware that although you had to pay into the SS system for 40 quarters (ten years) to be fully vested, the Mexico-U.S. Social Security Totalization Agreement gives Mexican citizens working in the U.S. full benefits after only 4 quarters (one year)? Are you aware this bill absolves all back taxes on illegals? Or that the illegal will receive probationary Z status with the government only having 24 hours for a background check that often is requested from a foreign nation? Try buying a hand gun and only allowing 24 hours for a background check. Can’t be done.
We don’t need “reform”. We need enforcement. Against employers. Against illegals. Against those who violate our laws day after day after day.
End the benefits. They will self deport. Eisenhower proved that.
Retire:
I have relatives living in Oklahoma and Texas today as well as some distant cousins in California.
I was in Oklahoma last week and my brother and I were talking about this. He is pretty tough on this issue himself. He is hoping Thompson gets the nomination. He has gone from left past center and to the right. He thinks that Dora the Explorer is part of some conspiracy to make us learn Spanish. He is also building a new house. I was there when the carpet guys showed up and they were Mexican. I was shocked when he did not throw them off the place, but he wanted that carpet down so he let them do the job.
The unemployment rate in Oklahoma is 3.9% and so they hired these guys, or that is what they said.
I know that is something that has to be dealt with, I am not trying to minimize it. But to some extent the horse it out of the barn. I think the states need to do more as well.
Retire:
Fine, I am sorry if I offended you when I said something about how bad it might be to just round people up and ship them out in cattle cars. Now you go right ahead and call me a liar and ask me why I did not get off my duff and mow my dead Grandmother’s lawn.
And I still do not know what you want me to say about the Mexican serial killer. The man was a psychopath. He should not have been here, criminals are bad. They should be deported or shot or whatever. But you know what? As a general rule homicidal maniac killers are not strong believers in obeying the law and even if you live in a nice home with a security system and a gun under the bed sometimes bad people will still get you. That man had relatives in El Paso and had been picked up and returned to Mexico before, he just did not stay there. So deporting him was not enough.
And killing this bill will not lead to stronger enforcement.
Terrye, damn, I am getting tired of trying to point out to you that we have enough criminals here without importing them. How many do you think we will identify with just 24 hours allowed for a background check?
Yes, Resendez was deported ONCE but he managed, like most illegals, to return at will and even voted in two Houston elections. What makes you think that when 12-20 million more have to be imput into the system, things are going to be any better? Even known gang members will be given “probationary” visas.
The question should be, will this bill make things worse? The answer is yes and so we are better off with the status quo than a bill that will further exacerbate the problem when we have no guarantee that the elites in Washington will ever fund the things necessary to stop the flow of more illegals.
AJ: The problem with the bill is not its guest worker provisions, or its path to legalization. The problem is that it does not enforce the borders. All kinds of things become reasonable once we actually stop the flow of illegal immigration. Nothing is reasonable without enforcing the borders. Can’t we be united in demanding that whatever laws we settle on actually be enforced?
I cannot believe the BS I’m reading here. Do any of you have a clue what GWB proposed and the warning he attached to his 5 POINT PLAN? Terrye does but the rest of you … power, getting your own way, ad hom attacks at anyone who would dare question you who are big shot negotiators or just stupid.
GWB – May 15, 2006:
And then the warning:
I supported this plan then and as one who lives on the border, I still think it the best plan put forward.
The GOP is killing itself. A political party is not a religion which requires members to accept it’s tenets as is. In politics everyone can beleive the way he wants and it is obvious that the majority of the people in this country have had it with kowtowing to foreigners who have sneaked in here to get in on the good life and repay our generosity by getting out in the streets to defile our flag, call us names and demand that we give them more. Apparently the GOP thinks that because the Dhemmicrats are so far out in lala land that we have no choice but to accept what they have to offer. When it comes to a choice of the lesser of two evils I will join the majority of Americans who have already decided that it doesn’t matter if they vote or not because their vote isn’t going to make a difference anyway.
Squiggler, couldn’t agree with you more. I am a Bush conservative and proud of it. This bill as much as I have been able to read, is just right.
Terrye said
I bet none of the people who are in a panic over Mexican laborers picking lettuce ever had to do anything resembling that kind of work
Well lady myself personally 50 years ago almost I worked my father’s dairy farm he was a hired tender for and then on weekends I worked the “black dirt” onion farms of Orange County New York to earn money to buy a bicycle as a kid.
In slow times in the economy before I learned the stock market could make money on ups or downs, I worked the potato fields of North Florida to get me and my family by.
The only stopper was waiting for the right time to dispose of some of the land assets I had purchased as a kid to have the initial capital to start playing the markets.
Terrye
Read back, I have addressed the problem of overstayed visas. Do you suggest that people overstay visas we should not tighten the border?
Good then go live in south LA, California or the lower 9th ward in New Orleans and don’t put locks on your doors.
You will surely live in interesting times.
Squiggler
Like an old wise Chief told me years ago in the Navy, there was no family and bunch of rug rats issued to me in my seabag at boot camp. If someone made the choice to try to raise a family on what the services paid then , quite frankly it was a poor decision from a financial standpoint on their part, no matter how noble their other aims were.
Instead I was stationed for years in Hawaii and invested most of my money and bonuses in condos with some money spent partying with all the tourist ladies for other needs and never left a family behind wondering if the stove went out would we have enough money to fix or replace the stove so my brood could have a hot meal each day.
On the other extreme I have seen sailors spend 100% of their paychecks partying through and entire west pacific deployment and at the end the only thing they had to show for it was a custom cigarette lighter and a tattoo.
Squiggler posted GWB’s 5 points:
* First, the United States must secure its borders.
* Second, to secure our border, we must create a temporary worker program.
Sorry, that is not how borders are secured. They are secured by building an impassable barrier (the equivalent of building another 1500 miles of interstate) across the entire southern border (where almost all the illegal crossings occur), and then being equally thorough in blocking illegal entry by plane and boat.
For a country that built the interstate highway system fifty years ago, this is easily doable.
AJ
They crossed the border or overstayed their visa, thats ILLEGAL
They worked here and didn’t pay taxes, thats ILLEGAL
They got false documents to do the above, thats ILLEGAL
So the bill as formed wipes out MULTIPLE ILLEGALITIES.
And don’t forget this is technically a Senate bill which can’t initiate funding related bills and was partly why GWB did not support the back tax portion that McCaine amendmended back in.
Now opponents of the bill on the house side can “blue slip” the Senate version. Read Captains Quarters on this issue.