Jul 16 2012

How Will Witness 9 (GZ’s Molested Cousin) Effect TM Charges?

Published by at 8:25 pm under All General Discussions,Trayvon Martin Case

Well, a bombshell dropped in the George Zimmerman trial for Murder 2 for the killing of young Trayvon Martin:

A relative of George Zimmerman claims she was molested by him when they were both children, the latest allegation in the case against the former neighborhood watch volunteer charged in the fatal shooting of Trayvon Martin.

The interview with police, done nearly a month after the February shooting, was made public Monday after local media fought to have it released, over objections from prosecutors and the defense.

You can get all the evidence regarding Witness 9 here. Witness 9 was the anonymous caller who told police there was a sinister, hidden side to the soft-spoken, policeman-wannabe George Zimmerman. I actually don’t see much impact on the trial except to once more destroy GZ’s credibility (which is already shot to pieces). Even her claims of racism are not against GZ, but against his estranged mother. Clearly this woman has some legitimate beef with GZ, but very little is applicable to the TM case. The only connection that might be made is how well GZ can hide brutal behavior, and how little he cares about his victims (his apology to Witness 9 and her parents was a sad joke).

To be honest, not much more is needed in the case against GZ. As you sift through the evidence, more and more problems become clear. One thing I was thinking of doing was listing how GZ’s story changes over time to deal with serious flaws in his original telling. Something like this [click to enlarge]:

The data comes from this impressive analysis (not all of which I agree with BTW).  I still may do one because a few key items are missing from this table – specifically the CVSA interview which has some real damning statements from GZ. For example, at around the 28 minute mark in the interview, GZ drops this whopper on why he got out of the car (may not be 100% accurate transcription):

GZ: All the houses I was next to were the back of the houses, they are town houses so I did not know the address. They [dispatch] said we need to know what street you’re on, what address. …[GZ babbles about giving his street address]… and I got out of my car to look for a street sign so I could tell what street I was on, and … there was no street sign, and I couldn’t make out the house in front of me because there was a big pick up truck there

This is of course a lie – he saw TM run and he jumped out of his car to follow, without any prompting from the dispatcher. All the mythical interchanges with dispatch on addresses and such never happened. But the dumb part was the reason for not using an address right in front of him. It seems this ginormous pick up truck was blocking the address number of the first house (now known to be the house of Witnesses 11 and 20) at the end of the building TM ran behind. This is why GZ has to run across the top of the T to the other side of the next building over to find any house numbers.

…. yeah, right. Check out where the house numbers are:

I mean – really? A truck totally blocked this from any view? GZ had to walk over 200 feet away, crossing two sets of buildings instead, just to find a house number (instead of maybe looking at the next house to the right)? Prosecutors are going to have a field day with this BS. BTW, recall we have two witnesses who testified GZ told them he got out of the car to find TM. And GZ admitted he was chasing TM to the police dispatcher.

Of course, the fact TM ran from GZ, who then follows TM when he runs away, is proof enough this was not a self defense or stand your ground case for GZ. When one party tries to avoid the conflict (like running away) then the person who continues the confrontation is the criminal, and the other is the victim.

In this case a dead victim.

So I don’t see how Witness 9 does anything for or against GZ. His troubles are monumental already. His story is impossible on numerous levels, with witnesses and evidence poking holes into his claims. They will not need to use witness 9 in court.

But I bet some of those standing by Zimmerman now (like is Air Marshall buddy) will be rethinking which side they want to be on….


125 responses so far

125 Responses to “How Will Witness 9 (GZ’s Molested Cousin) Effect TM Charges?”

  1. Redteam says:

    mata: I just used 2 chits, now you get 2. ready? go.

  2. BGG says:


    Since you consider yourself to be “well qualified as a ‘critical thinker’ ” please explain the 50′ gap in Zimmerman’s story.

  3. Mata says:

    Thanks for the “chit transfer” okay to respond, RT… LOL

    Let’s see if I can drag out the pertinents, in between the usual caustic personal commentary that supposedly only I engage in… heh

    for GZ to say that TM had his hands over his mouth, probably doesn’t mean that he had exactly both hands 100% of the time over his mouth and even if he did, it doesn’t mean that GZ couldn’t have been screaming for help.

    This is where spending more time watching GZ videos and listening to the evidence would be of aid, RT. Although it should be remembered that we are only discussing a life and death [/sarc] struggle that lasted about a minute from argument to gunshot

    1: 911 calls and PD docs say the yelling for help went up to and stopped at the time of the gun shot. In the 38 seconds span (of what is pretty much a relatively short confrontation), there were 14 identifiable calls for help which ceased with the gunshot. This is all in the May 26th PD doc dump, FYI.

    2: GZ’s own version in his CVSA video describes that Martin’s two hands…. one on his mouth and one on his nose… plus his full weight *immediately* preceded any imaginary fight for the gun he forgot he had. Why? Because Martin had to remove one of those hands to go for the gun.

    3: When Martin’s hands weren’t on his mouth and nose, they were doing that life threatening head banging.

    So… when was GZ supposedly yelling for help, 14 times in a 38 second span just before the shot? While his head was being banged and he though he “was going to lose consciousness”? Nope.. that can’t be. How about when his nose and mouth were covered and he was being suffocated, immediately before that imaginary struggle for the gun? Nope, that can’t be either.

    Yet the yelling for help stopped with the gunshot.

    When you figure out how what George says works with reality, let us know.

    I do believe that the judge will be disqualified for prejudice, but we’ll see.

    Humm… from the way this statement is worded, you don’t seem to be comprehending the process.

    The sitting Judge rules on his own disqualification… and it must be responded to within 30 days of the filing. So if you’re expecting some judgmental judicial slap down from the higher bench powers, you’ll be waiting a long time.

    Lester may only consider the legal sufficiency of the claims by the defense and Zimmerman… not whether they are necessarily factual… i.e. there is no culpability of guilt associated if granted. He can also take the initiative to disqualify himself if he so chooses.

    Frankly, based on Lester’s recent additions to the case (O’Mara’s personal correspondence INRE Zim’s paypal account), I think he’ll grant O’Mara’s motion. Not because there is any guilt associated to a Judge reading the riot act to someone before him. That’s a daily occurrence, and isn’t necessarily confined just to defendants. Heaven knows that many a defense attorney and prosecutor have discovered a new orifice after a day in court with a judge.

    Rather I think that Lester will grant the motion for disqualification in order not to have any public perception of injustice construed for Zimmerman.

  4. Redteam says:

    mata: “The sitting Judge rules on his own disqualification… and it must be responded to within 30 days of the filing. So if you’re expecting some judgmental judicial slap down from the higher bench powers, you’ll be waiting a long time.”

    jumping to conclusions? I know the judge has to recuse himself. I just happened to call it a disqualification (by himself)

    “Rather I think that Lester will grant the motion for disqualification in order ”

    see? even you call it a disqualification. You always start out with I’m wrong, then you argue my point as if it were yours and then say it’s correct. have you been tested for senility? you should consider it.

  5. Mata says:

    No, RT… you statement in full was:

    I do believe that the judge will be disqualified for prejudice

    If Lester disqualifies himself, it will be based on the legal merits of the motion for disqualification. NOT whether there was any factual bias or truth to the motion’s statements as to their reasons for requesting disqualification.

    I’m going to guess that you’re going to stash your response to the 38 seconds of yelling prior to the gunshot, and GZ’s own statement that he was being smothered with BOTH hands prior to his pulling the gun, right along with the Dershowitz statement about the bond hearing, the TM phone records that haven’t been released to the public, etc etc.

  6. BGG says:

    see? even you call it a disqualification. You always start out with I’m wrong, then you argue my point as if it were yours and then say it’s correct.”

    Oh good grief. Mata never argued that your use of the word “disqualification” was inaccurate.

    The point that she was making was that you appeared to have been thinking someone else would “disqualify” the judge:

    “I do believe that the judge will be disqualified for prejudice, but we’ll see. “

    Your clumsy wording makes it sound like you believe the judge is subject to being “disqualified” by some outside force and that is factually inaccurate.

    Perhaps you should focus more on what is actually being argued rather than running off at the keyboard with more of your schoolyard insults.

    Still waiting on you to put your “critical thinking” skillz to work in order to explain the 50′ gap in Z’s story.

  7. Redteam says:

    Do I hear an echo? mata: your point? you don’t seem to have one.

    look, GZ killed TM in self defense as far as the evidence indicates. 38 seconds, all that means nothing. nothing. We all know, by now that TM started running at about the point of the T. if a confrontation occurred at the T, that means he had to come back to the T.

    mata: since you think I ignore some of your questions, when are you going to answer the one about how the cell phone ended up between TM and BG’s apartment. You’ve tried to dismiss it. that means you don’t have an answer.

    you said: “Is it not then possible that Martin, hiding in the bushes and waiting (probably for what seem an eternity but was at least 2 minutes), thought the coast was clear ”

    so now you’re conceding there were bushes there, you do recall that both you and AJ were adamant that there were no bushes anywhere around, even though every picture clearly shows them at every apartment. I need an anwer, where did the bushes materialize from? How did the cell phone get closer to BG’s apt than TM was?

  8. ivehadit says:

    Incredible interview on Hannity now. Very impressive,IMHO.this guy is not a liar, IMHO.

  9. Mata says:

    Yeah… what we need, after at least eleven police statements/transcripts and/or video is yet another Zimmerman fable.

    I lasted 30 seconds. Why? All below paraphrased:

    Zimmerman: I went down to Retreat View Circle to get an address (lie… he was parked in front of an address)

    Hannity: How far away were you from your car?

    Zimmerman: I would guess about 100 feet

    Hannity: So you were never more than 100 feet from you car?

    Zimmerman: No sir

    The approx distance just to the tee in the path from his car location is about165 feet. It’s another 100 feet from there to Retreat View Circle… a total of 265 feet from his car. I can’t stand Hannity because he is a dumber than dirt conservative commentator that does more damage than aid. If he knew anything about this case, he’d have at least approximate distances and not bother with these details which are not only inaccurate, but he’s too stupid to contradict. They have been on the released evidence crime scene photos and are easily calculated using Google Earth’s path measuring tools. But Hannity is nothing more than a “tool” himself, and a poor one at that.

    Now the looking for an address is a repeated lie he does, since he told his air marshal friend and his co workers that he was looking for Martin, not an address. I’ll give Zimmerman a pass on adding yet another lie about the distance since he may just be a bad judge of distance. Hannity should have known better. But that’s about all I could stomach.

    So here’s what it is,ivehadit….If you need Zimmerman, 24/7, all the time, there are about eleven official police statements, transcripts and/or audio tapes available for you to listen to, over and over. I’ve pretty much had my fill of enough Zimmerman versions of this fable to last a lifetime. I don’t need another one from Hannity.

    That appearance is to drum up money for his defense. So I suggest that, since facts interfere with your self perceived reality, you just send on your cash and lend your support so that O’Mara, Zimmerman and Hannity haven’t wasted their time. I surely won’t be wasting any more of mine.

  10. ivehadit says:

    Disgust is what I feel and not for George Zimmerman.

  11. Mata says:

    RT: since you think I ignore some of your questions, when are you going to answer the one about how the cell phone ended up between TM and BG’s apartment. You’ve tried to dismiss it. that means you don’t have an answer.

    Been there, done that.

  12. ivehadit says:

    Do not impugn Sean Hannity’s integrity. You have no basis for that whatsoever ever. And stop attacking those who disagree with your INTERPRETATIONS.

  13. BGG says:

    Now someone’s gettin’ all testy over a TV personality.


  14. Mata says:

    BGG… LOL

    ivehadit… I have no “basis”? Thought I just gave one… Love Levin, tho we don’t always agree. Love Rush, but the same.

    Hannity? Couldn’t debate his way out of a wet paper bag. As aptly demonstrated with even a brief look at his bogus and uninformed/unprepped interview.

    It is what it is… a fund raiser. Just send you cash and be done with it. Your choice. I’ve got no qualms what you do with your hard earned cash.

  15. ivehadit says:

    Aj, I don’t know what has become of your site but it is not what it used to be. Too much negative intent and very little good-faith discussions going on…not why I have come here all these years.

  16. AJStrata says:

    Mata, only got a glimpse, but St. George was clear:it was God’s will he killed that unarmed boy.

    Gag me.

    Another version, more lies. He has admitted three times to following TM in the first days after the killing. Now he claims he could not read te house addresses right in front of his car.

    Moronic alibi, but apparently if you need to believe in St George, facts won’t get in the way.

  17. Mata says:

    Just a photo op / fundraiser event, as far as I can tell, AJ. The desperate feedback I’m getting at the other place is almost pathetically laughable. Something about Zimmerman telling Hannity that Martin was aware he was on the phone with the police?

    Boy, that dead teen sure was omnipotent and a larger than life military arts fighter…

    RT, do try to get your nemesis types straight. I’ve never said a word about bushes or shrubbery. I’ve been aware since day one that there is from typical Florida flora down that area.

    And of course the 38 seconds mean nothing to you. You simple don’t care about Zimmerman’s story vs physical facts. That isn’t my problem.

  18. BGG says:

    Z’s interview on television last night has more holes than a screen door.

    Yet more variations and deviations.

    Yet more that doesn’t fit with the physical evidence.

    His flippant attitude and obvious lack of remorse is not going to benefit him at all.

  19. Layman says:

    WOW !!!

    Believe all you like that GZ is a liar. Great!

    Believe all you like that TM DID NOT do anything to provoke or attack GZ. Great!

    But to somehow conclude that it is IMPOSSIBLE for TM to be a threat to GZ… ???

    AJ: Watched the interview. Never heard GZ claim “it was God’s will he killed that unarmed boy.” That is purely your personal dislike for GZ beeding over into you making an over the top hyperbolic statement.

    Mata: “… a larger than life military arts fighter…” No one ever said that, but you seem to believe that it is impossible that a 6′ 190 lb “kid” could be a threat. So you to allow your disgust for GZ to bleed into over the top hyperbole.

    GZ may very well be a rat and a liar and he did take the life of TM. I just don’t get why you two take it so personally that you have to make stupid (IMHO) statements about GZ and go on the attack against anyone who thinks there may be some elements of truth in GZ version of events.

    Perhaps we have a new disorder… Zimmerman derangement syndrome (ZDS)?

  20. Layman says:

    GZ’s story keeps changing! GZ’s story has some holes in it! GZ is a rat liar!

    Some questions to ponder: Has a rape victim ever identified the wrong man as her attacker? Have multiple eye witnesses ever had very different versions of the same event? Has a witness on the stand ever been forced to change their testimony when confronted with hard evidence – even though they believed their version of events was true?

    Is it possible that a guy who got punched in the face hard enough to break his nose, got knocked to the ground and had his head pounded on a sidewalk, who went through the trauma of shooting and killing a person – is it possible that that person has some holes in their memory? Is it possible that that person unconciously has been trying to fill in the gaps and make sense of what happened?

    I think so. That is why I’m not ready to jump on every discrepancy and immediately conclude he was manufacturing an alibi on the fly.

    That’s why when I picture the fight in my mind I try to visualize what it would have been like. I don’t just say that because GZ said A, B, C that is all that occured. In my visualization I realize GZ probably described less than 10% of the actual details.

    That’s why I conducted a little experiment to see what the real dynamic might have looked and felt like. I don’t simply look at one little piece of evidence such as the gunshot wound angle and conclude GZ’s story is impossible.

    None of this means I’m a GZ groupie. It simply means I’m looking for the truth. Let the attacks begin….